GRAND SEIKO

[georgehh]

Η seiko τουλάχιστον έχει 500 designs η rolex ποσα? 2-3?,α ξέχασα καινοτόμησε χοντραίνοντας τα lugs και γι αυτό αύξησε τις τιμές, έβαλε μέταλλο παραπάνω... :-D:-D:-D:-D:-D seikara σε αγαπάμε και ασε τους άλλους haters να λένε.(Χούμορ κάνω).Υγεία και να χαιρόμαστε όλοι τα ρολόγια μας παιδιά...

[Aris911]

Καλυτερα 3 σχεδια και γαματα που να μιλαει ολος ο κοσμος  παρα 103 και εκτρωματα και που δεν την ξερουν ουτε οι ιδιοι.
Και η Πορσε 3 σχεδια εχει αλλα ...

[GiannisTissot]

Είναι καλοκαιρινό, επίτηδες έχει τέτοια πουσουαρ για να ανοίγεις τις μπύρες....

Στάλθηκε από το SM-J530F μου χρησιμοποιώντας Tapatalk

[sea_dweller]

Sorry guys...

Και εγώ παραδέχομαι πλέον (μετά από 2 νέες αγορές 116610ln - 214270 τον προηγούμενο μήνα) ότι είμαι ταγμένος  rolexakias  όμως δεν μπορώ να μην συμφωνήσω με τα παιδιά παραπάνω (απλά κάποια σχέδια της είναι τελείως άκυρα). Τι να πούμε όμως για την απίθανη αυτή εταιρεία.

[harolagoha]

Θεωρω οτι ειναι δειγμα ιαπωνικης αισθητικης η ελλειψη αρμονιας και η συνθεση ετεροκλητων στοιχειων σ’αυτην την σειρα...Προσωπικα δεν το θεωρω ασχημο αλλα κι ουτε ομορφο, μου βγαζει ομως αναμεικτα συναισθηματα..Αυτη η  επιτηδευμενη διαφορετικοτητα απ τα συνηθισμενα το κανει να ξεχωριζει.. Δειτε και τα μοντελα της ball....

[capt-dim]

Η ακομα και για ξυνεσε
Υγ. μα υπαρχει ασχημο grand seiko; Βγαζει ασχημα η εταιρειαρα; Τι κακες κουβεντες ειναι αυτες

για δείτε κάτι ομορφιές .... ρολόγια για τα καρναβάλια ...

[georgehh]

για δείτε κάτι ομορφιές .... ρολόγια για τα καρναβάλια ...

Χαχααααα οτι πρέπει για Μύκονο...

[Aris911]

Γιωργο η επιτυχια της Ρολεξ ειναι οτι ρολοι και να βγαλει. Ακομα και ποιο ασχημο απο οποιο αλλο ρολοι θα πουληθη πολυ ακριβο κατι που δεν μπορει να πετυχει αλλη εταιρεια.
Αυτο κατι λεει.
Η ασχημια που λες εσυ ειναι μοντελο για γυναικες. Και στις γυναικες ειναι πανεμορφο.Δεν θελει και πολυ μυαλο να καταλαβει καποιος οτι τιγρε πολυχρομο πετρατο βγηκε για αντρες. Απλη λογικη.
Ενω τα μοντελα της Σεικο με τα σπυρια για πουσουαρ ειναι για αντρες και ειναι κακασχημα.

[Aris2176]

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[pugman]

Not Just a Quartz: The Grand Seiko 9F Movement




Introduction
The Grand Seiko 9F family of quartz movements is arguably the most sophisticated quartz movement ever made. Developed in 1993, even at the time of this writing, 2014, many of its features have not been replicated by the competition. A great quartz movement, like a great mechanical movement, can have a pedigree worth honoring. The Grand Seiko 9S85 automatic may share no parts with the legendary 1960s Hi-Beats that won at the chronometer trials but to understand the significance of the 9S85 and why it’s so important today, you need to appreciate its connection to the past. So in order to appreciate why the Grand Seiko 9F is so important to Seiko and its fans, we have to go back. Way, way back.




Humble Beginnings
What you’re looking at is the first Swiss quartz clock, manufactured after WW2. It’s impressive. What Seiko did when they found out they would be timing the 1964 Tokyo Olympics, however, is more impressive.


That’s the QC-951 Crystal Chronometer, the very first portable quartz clock in the world. Its batteries lasted a then-astonishing 1 year and it established the now-familiar generic accuracy rating for quartz watches. Amazingly, the QC-951 was just 1/400th the size of the next smallest quartz clock at that time. Even when it was released in 1963, it was accurate to just 0.2 seconds per day, or about 15 seconds a month. The great contribution of the QC-951 was its ingeniously low power consumption. That technology would make Seiko’s next great quartz accomplishment a possibility.


By the way, the decision to manufacture everything Seiko could need in house for the 1964 Olympics lead to the following achievements: the 1st portable LCD, the first portable printer, the foundation of the Seiko Epson printer company, the first handheld computer, the first kinetic watch and the first (and only) spring drive. Every single one of those achievements can be traced back to the single decision to create everything Seiko would need for the 1964 Olympics in house. How’s that for an investment? But I digress.


Fast forward just 6 years to 1969. By now Seiko has released the world’s first quartz wall clock and Japan’s first desktop computer. Seiko is not satisfied with only having beaten the world with its mechanical watches in the observatory chronometer trials, and following their founder Kintaro Hattori’s motto, they would be one step ahead of the rest. They didn’t waste a second in releasing the world’s first quartz wristwatch, the Seiko Astron. Two years ago they had created the world’s most accurate mechanical wristwatch, now they’d created the most accurate watch period. It’s amazing to think that the 1969 Astron was accurate to + or – 5 seconds per month, which is actually more accurate than the QC-951 clock and the majority of modern quartz today. For comparison, the next most accurate production wristwatch was the Bulova Accutron with its famous tuning fork movement, and it was rated for a then-amazing 1 minute per month. It was revolutionary, not evolutionary. With that amazing achievement in mind we can start to understand why Grand Seiko values its modern day quartz so much. They correctly consider themselves the keepers of the torch for quartz.


Contemporary Seiko Quartz
Fast forward to 1993. Quartz technology has become utterly commonplace and now virtually every company is competing on features. Having the best quartz movement means everything to many companies. So it comes as no surprise that when Grand Seiko took on the task of creating a new movement, it needed to be a radical new design.
Grand Seiko’s goals were simple: create the single best watch movement ever made. Then, as now, quartz had certain limitations. Although quartz movements were very accurate and immune to isochronism and positional variance, they were still affected by temperature. Quartz movements also couldn’t hold the massive dauphine hands that Grand Seikos were known for. Although quartz movements were already very tough and reliable, they had to have frequent battery changes, which created an opportunity for dust and debris to enter the movement and cause problems down the road. These issues with quartz technology, among others, motivated Grand Seiko to create a radically new movement with features that, 21 years since its introduction, have not been replicated by the competition.
Perhaps the most unique and noteworthy feature of the 9F family is the twin pulse control motor. Grand Seiko was dealing with the apparent compromise between using a more powerful motor to move their massive dauphine hands and shortening the battery life. The ingenious solution was a motor that moves twice per second in a very small amount of time. Looking at a 9F quartz watch ticking, you can only see it tick once, like any other watch. But under super slow motion, you can actually see two distinct movements of the seconds hand. This design allowed Grand Seiko to keep a three year battery life while using full sized hands.
Another unique contribution of the 9F is its sealed cabin. If you compare the 9F to other high quality quartz movements, you can observe many gaps where dust or debris can enter. The 9F, conversely, can have the battery changed very easily yet the rest of the movement is sealed so nothing can contaminate it. Because of this design, this watch has the longest service interval in the world. Grand Seiko suggests that the lubrication in this watch, thanks to the sealed cabin, will be good up to 50 years.
Perhaps one of the most appreciated advantages of the 9F quartz is the anti-backlash mechanism. We’ve all been annoyed by having a quartz where the seconds hand doesn’t hit all the markers or, perhaps even worse, there’s a noticeable wobble every time the second hand stops. The 9F fixes these issues with its backlash auto-adjust mechanism, which adds a regulatory wheel. Thus, 9Fs are much more likely to hit every marker than other quartz movements and there won’t be any vibration when the seconds hand stops.
Yet another advantage to the 9F family is that the date change is fast—really, really fast. In fact, the date change on a 9F takes just 1/2000th of a second. Most watches can take an hour or two to change, but the 9F is so fast that you will literally miss it if you blink.
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An interesting, but not well publicized feature, of the 9F quartz (as well as spring drives) is that the coil block is uniformly wound, making it more efficient. On the left we see an ordinary coil block, but on the right we see a cross-section of the coil blocks in the 9F and spring drive movements.

Of course, the most obvious advantage of the 9F is its supreme accuracy. The least accurate 9F is rated for 10 seconds a year, relative to 15 seconds a month for an ordinary quartz. Many 9F movements are rated for an astonishing 5 seconds a year, tying them for the most accurate movement in the world. This achievement is made possible by several technologies, perhaps most notably thermocompensation, which helps the 9F defeat quartz’s worst enemy, temperature. The movement detects changes in temperature over 500 times a day and compensates for these changes in order to minimize the impact of temperature.
But this isn’t all that goes into making a super accurate Grand Seiko quartz. Seiko makes all their quartz crystals in house, which allows them to ensure ideal quality control from the bottom to the top of the corporation. Only the very best quartz crystals are then selected for use in the 9F. Then, the crystals are aged for 3 months. As if that weren’t enough, only the best of those are then selected for certain Grand Seiko watches with a 5 second a year rating.
The 9F is much more easily adjusted for future accuracy as well. Even if the accuracy drifts over time, it is a simple matter to move the pacing switch to compensate, meaning that even in extreme conditions or over a great deal of time, the 9F can maintain its nearly flawless accuracy.
Finally, each of the 9F’s three hands is on an independent axis, assuring that the hands move smoothly and precisely.
Above all, a Grand Seiko quartz is a Grand Seiko. That means it’s still hand assembled and tested by master watchmakers. No corners are cut on the 9F compared to the 9S mechanical or 9R spring drive—it receives the same degree of attention and skill. And yes, even the battery it comes with is in house, although it can accept any brand’s battery.

Not Just a Quartz
So perhaps after all of that you can see why Seiko and Grand Seiko hold quartz in such high regard. The modern day 9F honors the major achievements of Seiko in the 1960s and their continuing innovation. The fact that much of what makes the 9F so special has not been effectively replicated in over 20 years shows just how ahead of its time it was. Grand Seiko decided to focus on the actual performance of the movement rather than a feature set. Other movements, including other Seikos (even before 1993), may have perpetual calendars and other impressive features, but no other quartz movement in the world does as good a job of simply displaying the time. From being able to use full sized hands, to making the seconds hand hit the markers with no lash, to making the date change incredibly quick, and of course, being super accurate, the 9F aimed to create the best simple 3 hander it possibly could, and it succeeded.


https://timelessluxwatches.com/reviews/not-just-quartz-grand-seiko-9f-movement/

[pugman]

OPINION: WHY THE GRAND SEIKO SBGX069 / SGBX269 IS A QUARTZ WATCH YOU NEED IN YOUR COLLECTION



To many, Seiko is synonymous for their functional yet affordable timepieces. But at the top end, they have the Grand Seiko line, first introduced in 1960 and in 2017 became a brand of its own right. Grand Seiko has relentlessly pursued the idea of creating the perfect wristwatch. The subject of our discussion is the Grand Seiko SBGX069 / SBGX269, with the 9F quartz movement, and we think they might just have succeeded.


The SBGX069 (pictured here)/SBGX269, with the Grand Seiko calibre 9F.

Disrupt or be disrupted: it seems that innovation paves the way forward. And no one does innovation better than Seiko; they’re the forefront of technology intensive and value-added timepieces. In 1969, Seiko released the revolutionary Astron: the first production quartz wristwatch, beating the Swiss at their own game. It sold for ¥ 450,000, which was roughly equivalent to the cost of a Toyota Corolla at that time. It was a lot of money, especially back then, partly due to its massive development span of over 10 years. This resulted in poor sales, with only 200 produced. However as with any technology and time, industralisation followed. This caused prices to fall and soon quartz became the choice of the masses, upsetting the Swiss watch industry. This was the phase which we now know as the Quartz Crisis.

The release of the first Grand Seiko Calibre 9F in 1993 created a big buzz among collectors. By then, quartz has become a more affordable alternative to intricately handcrafted, handsome mechanical movements. And to many, the idea of a high-end quartz watch may seem absurd; a paradox. But when a brand is adamant in their pursuit for perfection, we pay attention: the calibre 9F may very well be the best quartz movement ever created.

The Grand Seiko SBGX069 / SBGX269
As a case in point, we consider the Grand Seiko SBGX069. This model is now renamed SBGX269 with the Grand Seiko branding, but is essentially the same watch.

We shall start with the movement.

The movement: the 9F
As with all modern Grand Seiko Quartz watches, the SBGX069 uses the manufacture Calibre 9F.  The 9F is a product of the Seiko Epson based in Shiojiri.
The SBGX069 / SBGX269 features the calibre 9F62. As the SBGX069 does not have a display case back, and we did not open the case back, we could not examine the movement during our hands-on session. But we do know how the movement looks like as our Chief Editor have examined it during his visit to the factory.


The Grand Seiko lion graces the solid case back of the SBGX069. The lion represents Grand Seiko’s commitment to be “King of watches”.

Unlike the industrialised robotic assembly where most quartz movements are made, the 9F is hand-assembled, hand-finished and hand-decorated. Built more like a mechanical movement with only the visible battery and coil serving as a reminder of its electronic heart. The 9F looks the part of a proper haute horlogerie movement.


The impeccable finishing and detailing on the calibre 9F by Grand Seiko.

So it is safe to say that the 9F is not your typical quartz movement. It also contains more components than a generic Swiss automatic movement and built to a higher standard. The assembly requires the talent of 2 expert craftsmen – one to assemble the movement and another just to install the date indicator.
This perfectionist mindset is exercised right down to the installation of the hands. With a mere 0.2mm separating them, only the most experienced craftsmen are entrusted with this detail.

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Every single component of a Grand Seiko right down to the installation of hands and date indicator is done with a perfectionist mindset.

The attention to detail is manifested even in the minute details. Seiko’s quartz crystals are grown in-house, with only the purest selected. To ensure consistency in its performance, each individual crystal is aged for up to 3 months, and, paired to a temperature sensitive integrated circuit that adjusts its frequency 540 times per day. The result? A guaranteed class leading performance of +/- 10 seconds per year. True that this level of performance is not the best in the world, but it is extremely good, and achieved by only a handful.

 
The in-house grown quartz crystal on the left, paired to a temperature sensitive integrated circuit in the middle. This results in a guaranteed accuracy of +/-10 seconds per year. Picture credit: Joe Kirk. Note that the photograph is made on a sample movement, solely used for demonstration. The photographs are used with permission and taken from Joe’s Instagram account @josep.kirk.

Moreover, if there are any irregularities in timekeeping, the 9F can be fine tuned through its pacing switch similar to any mechanical movements.


The pacing switch on the 9F allows for fine-tuning of the movement without having to enter the internals. Picture credit: Joe Kirk. Note that the photograph is made on a sample movement, solely used for demonstration. The photographs are used with permission and taken from Joe’s Instagram account @josep.kirk.

What ascertains the calibre 9F as one of the best quartz movement in the world is its unrivalled 50 years’ service interval. This is because Seiko seals the movement in what they call a “sealed cabin”. What this means is that the movement is vacuum sealed within a cabin exterior. And gives it the extraordinary service interval. Probably the highest we have ever encountered. Of course this interval is theoretical. The air tight seal might preserve the lubricants for this long, but as the 9F is only 25 years old, it has not been tested yet. Seiko recommends a standard service interval of 3 to 5 years for the watch despite this theoretical service interval.  We recommend only to service a watch  when it is not running properly.
In a typical standard quartz watch, the movement is replaced during service and not service, while the calibre 9F is designed to be serviced in the long run.

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The “sealed cabin” as depicted here houses two of the most important parts of the 9F: its gear train and stepping motor. An air-tight seal prevents debris from entering the movement when it is exposed. It also helps to preserve the lubricant, allowing for its unrivalled 50-years service interval. Picture credit: Joe Kirk. Note that the photograph is made on a sample movement, solely used for demonstration. The photographs are used with permission and taken from Joe’s Instagram account @josep.kirk.


Another interesting aspect is the lengths Grand Seiko takes to ensure that each step of the seconds hand aligns itself to the seconds marker exactly. To ensure this, GS uses a special hairspring to tension to prevent backlash or vibration. The result is the 9F has a more assertive “jump” in the seconds hand.

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The special hairspring as depicted here is used in the backlash auto-adjust mechanism, allowing it to stabilise the seconds hand with every jump. Picture credit: Joe Kirk. Note that the photograph is made on a sample movement, solely used for demonstration. The photographs are used with permission and taken from Joe’s Instagram account @josep.kirk.

Despite the performance and qualities it boasts, it still has a reasonable 3 years battery life which makes for a good daily driver. Changing the battery will not require the movement’s sealed cabin to be opened.

The case, dial and hands
Crafted using Seiko’s proprietary Bright Titanium alloy, the Grand Seiko SBGX069 / SBGX269 measures a comfortable 37mm diameter and 10mm thickness.


The Grand Seiko SBGX069’s Bright Titanium case measures 37mm in diameter and 10mm in height, weighing in at 79 grams.

The design language used in the SBGX029 is set out in the Grammar of Design pioneered in the 44GS. The case detailing is what you’d expect of a typical Grand Seiko: a blend of traditional Zaratsu and brushed finishing. No corners were cut, with the famed Zaratsu polishing being meticulously applied to every aspect of the watch. The polished bezel and case sides, fused with the brilliant brushed lugs gives it a bright and seductive appearance.
On handling the watch for the first time, it has the light (79g, watch including bracelet) yet robust feel of the titanium and leaves a deep impression. With a bracelet forged from the same alloy, it makes for an excellent daily driver. It sits well on an average wrist and is no doubt a convenient grab-and-go everyday piece; easy to slip on and unobtrusive.


The Bright Titanium bracelet and case allows for a light yet robust feeling watch, perfect for daily wear. The bracelet deserves a special mention as its included half links allows for more precise adjustments, making for a more comfortable fit.

The SBGX069 features an intricate and enchanting pattern imprinted on a gorgeous black dial. This model features the now discontinued ‘Seiko’ branding at the top, instead of the ‘Grand Seiko’ branding (announced at Basel 2017) which is on the SGBX269.
Perhaps the most indispensable feature of any watch lies in its ability to tell the time. This model sports beautifully polished, consistent golden blade-edge hands. There is no applied lume, but the high-polished finish on the hands reflects light brilliantly, making time telling effortless in all but the darkest situations.
 

The highly legible, Zaratsu polished golden hands.

The breath-taking attention to detail extends right down to the applied gold indices: they are polished individually by hand, using the same Zaratsu technique as the case. The result is an exquisite, brilliant angular surface with high lustre, adding to its charm. And that’s just the tip of the iceberg – zoom in closer and you’ll notice the vertical stripes on each of the 11 indices. It might be a form of over-engineering as they’re barely noticeable on the wrist but serve as a true testament to Grand Seiko’s pursuit for watchmaking perfection.

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Attention to detail: Vertical stripes present on the zaratsu polished hour markers.


The golden hands and indices contrasts pleasantly with the intricately patterned black dial, giving a sophisticated and elegant feel to the watch. Overall, the dial is clean and legible.

Concluding Thoughts/Remarks
The SBGX069 / SBGX269 is as you’d expect with all other Grand Seiko watches, built with the idea of perfection in mind. Its sleek, full titanium construction, as well as a highly legible and gorgeous black dial makes it perfect for daily wear. The quality and finishing are on par with the Grand Seiko mechanical timepieces, only it features the convenience and benefits of quartz technology. And, with the watch coming in at a conservative 37mm, it is perfect for all but the largest of wrists.


 
 In terms of competition by similar quartz pieces, the calibre 9F might be compared to the likes of the Citizen CTQ57-0953 Chronomaster, nicknamed simply “The Citizen,” or the Longines’s VHP. Both have movements which are accurate to +/-5 seconds per year, making them more accurate than the 9F. The Citizen CTQ57 is a remarkable watch, and will be the subject of an in-depth investigation. But we digress. We think, however, that the Grand Seiko is in a league of its own when it comes to fit and finish. It is able to pull its own weight, and is worth checking out. We highly recommend that you do.




https://deployant.com/opinion-grand-seiko-sbgx069-sgbx269-quartz-watch-need-collection/

[harolagoha]

Πολυ καλο αρθρο!! Σεικαρα!!

[capt-dim]

Άρη πηρες ρολόι που θελει καθε 50 χρόνια σερβις τι θα κανει η σεικο Ελλάδας φυςικα Και θα κλείσει .....!!!!!

Μα τι ρολογια ειναι αυτα ....!!!!!!!

[Aris2176]

Άρη πηρες ρολόι που θελει καθε 50 χρόνια σερβις τι θα κανει η σεικο Ελλάδας φυςικα Και θα κλείσει .....!!!!!

Μα τι ρολογια ειναι αυτα ....!!!!!!!

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[pugman]

Πείτε μου αγαπητοί αξίζει να φαίνεται τέτοια μηχανή ή όχι γιατί "μας την είπε" o Άρης στην απάντηση μου ότι είναι μόνο κυκλώματα κ πυκνωτές... σιγά το πράγμα δηλαδή...

[andrey_]

Για να ειμαστε δικαιοι Αντωνοι, για να δινει καποιος καποιες χιλιαδες για να παρει quartz (δεν το εκανα για κανενα λογο), μαλλον ξερει για ποιο λογο το παιρνει και δε χρειαζεται μαθημα. Αλλο που σε 3 μηνες θα το βγαλει αγγελια.
Τωρα αν αξιζει να φαινεται η οχι αυτη η μηχανη, ειναι θεμα αισθητικης και αρα υποκειμενικο. Εμενα μου φαινεται λιγο αστειο να φαινεται μια μπαταρια που εμφανισιακα ειναι ιδια με των swatch. Αυτο δε σημαινει οτι η μηχανη δεν εχει τεχνολογια.

[Aris2176]

Για να ειμαστε δικαιοι Αντωνοι, για να δινει καποιος καποιες χιλιαδες για να παρει quartz (δεν το εκανα για κανενα λογο), μαλλον ξερει για ποιο λογο το παιρνει και δε χρειαζεται μαθημα. Αλλο που σε 3 μηνες θα το βγαλει αγγελια.
Τωρα αν αξιζει να φαινεται η οχι αυτη η μηχανη, ειναι θεμα αισθητικης και αρα υποκειμενικο. Εμενα μου φαινεται λιγο αστειο να φαινεται μια μπαταρια που εμφανισιακα ειναι ιδια με των swatch. Αυτο δε σημαινει οτι η μηχανη δεν εχει τεχνολογια.

Το ίδιο πράγμα είπαμε απλά εσύ με λίγο περισσότερα λόγια! Λογικό εάν σκεφτούμε ότι εσύ είσαι δικηγόρος και εγώ ένας πτωχός μηχανικος

Απορώ γιατί πραγματικά πρέπει να δώσω λόγο για την γνώμη μου και την κάθε αγορά που κάνω, και σε ποιον τελικά ? Το τραγικό την υπόθεσης ειναι, ότι πέρα απο την πλάκα και το χιούμορ που δίνει και παίρνει και ειναι θεμιτό και επιτρεπτό, ότι έχουμε περιφερόμενους πολέμιους την χ,ψ,ζ ωρολογιακης μπραντας, οι οποίοι με μηδενική ή σχεδόν μηδενική ωρολογιακή έμπειρια ως τελικοί χρήστες προσπαθούν να μας επιβάλουν τι θα λέμε, τι θα μας αρέσει και γιατί δεν θα μας αρέσει!!!

Θεωρώ ότι οποίος αγαπά το ρολόι, δεν μπορεί να τα καταφέρεται και να γίνετε πολέμιος της οποιαδήποτε μάρκας,είτε των Quartz, μηχανικών και πάει λέγοντας, μπορεί να έχει άποψη και γούστα βεβαίως βεβαίως αλλα μέχρι εκεί! Οι "φασιστικές/κομπλεξικες" τάσεις δεν χωρούν σε κανένα χώρο, ας χαλαρώσουμε λοιπόν...

Υ.Γ. Πράγματι ωραίο άρθρο Αντώνη!






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[bshop]

Για να ειμαστε δικαιοι Αντωνοι, για να δινει καποιος καποιες χιλιαδες για να παρει quartz (δεν το εκανα για κανενα λογο), μαλλον ξερει για ποιο λογο το παιρνει και δε χρειαζεται μαθημα. Αλλο που σε 3 μηνες θα το βγαλει αγγελια.

αν το βάλει θα το πάρω εγώ

[cupra73]

Εγώ πάντως θα ξήλωνα την seiko μπαταρία και θα έριχνα επάνω μια renata, θα έδειχνε πολύ καλύτερα μέσα από το τζάμι....

[capt-dim]

Αν η μπαταρία έγραφε Grand Seiko τοτε θα άξιζε σίγουρα το open back ....